Frankly, I don't pick either side here. While I could say that both sides did some pretty vile things. I have no illusion that Hamas are some sort of freedom fighters, because they are not and they definitely do not hold average Palestinians in heart. I in fact believe that since Hamas is created in the West, that Israel may have their hand in it. Just think every time there was supposed to be some truce, Hamas blows up a building in Tel Aviv and the conflict continues. Unfortunately, the conflict lasts for very long and as long as there is no real desire for achieving peace (from both sides, mind you), then it'll continue as the decades of this shit are persevering to happen.
Also, one very interesting thing here. Since this conflict renewal weeks ago, almost no one mentions anymore Russo-Ukrainian conflict. It's not anymore the main topic.

milster wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 27, 2023 8:11 pm

Frankly, I don't pick either side here. While I could say that both sides did some pretty vile things. I have no illusion that Hamas are some sort of freedom fighters, because they are not and they definitely do not hold average Palestinians in heart. I in fact believe that since Hamas is created in the West, that Israel may have their hand in it. Just think every time there was supposed to be some truce, Hamas blows up a building in Tel Aviv and the conflict continues. Unfortunately, the conflict lasts for very long and as long as there is no real desire for achieving peace (from both sides, mind you), then it'll continue as the decades of this shit are persevering to happen.
Also, one very interesting thing here. Since this conflict renewal weeks ago, almost no one mentions anymore Russo-Ukrainian conflict. It's not anymore the main topic.

Interesting point: The West is causing Putin problems regarding the Ukraine war and suddenly Israel is attacked and the West is seriously distracted. Maybe Putin wrote a big cheque to Hamas.........

milster wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 27, 2023 8:11 pm

Frankly, I don't pick either side here. While I could say that both sides did some pretty vile things. I have no illusion that Hamas are some sort of freedom fighters, because they are not and they definitely do not hold average Palestinians in heart. I in fact believe that since Hamas is created in the West, that Israel may have their hand in it. Just think every time there was supposed to be some truce, Hamas blows up a building in Tel Aviv and the conflict continues. Unfortunately, the conflict lasts for very long and as long as there is no real desire for achieving peace (from both sides, mind you), then it'll continue as the decades of this shit are persevering to happen.
Also, one very interesting thing here. Since this conflict renewal weeks ago, almost no one mentions anymore Russo-Ukrainian conflict. It's not anymore the main topic.

And you haven't revealed any secrets. There are no conspiracy speculations or secrets in this.
Initially, as soon as the first political rudiments of the emergence of "Hamas", Israel saw them as the main political rivals of the "Palestine Liberation Organization" of Ya. Arafat, as well as against the Palestinian political organization Fatah. Israel has always (openly or veiled) pursued the goal of destroying Palestine. Therefore, initially Israel supported Hamas politically and financially in every possible way.
Israel is practically a complete creature of the United States. Or vice versa, given how many Jewish lobbyists are in the so-called "shadow or deep state of the United States", which really governs the United States. Therefore, it is their practice to first support structures or political organizations that are extremely dubious in their deeds, for the sake of achieving situational objectives in their own interests, and then, when they do not need them, abandon them. The latter, accordingly, take offense at this, after which the U.S. or Israel recognize them as terrorists and start a "noble and just war" against terrorism, justified by the Western community. This was the case with Bin-Laden, whom the US actually created and supported in Afghanistan against the USSR. This was the case with ISIS, the backbone of which was made up in the beginning by the Iraqi military, who betrayed S. Hussein at the instigation of the US. Therefore, there is nothing new in this practice of the U.S. or Israel.

Bobby wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 27, 2023 8:38 pm

Interesting point: The West is causing Putin problems regarding the Ukraine war and suddenly Israel is attacked and the West is seriously distracted. Maybe Putin wrote a big cheque to Hamas.........

I think this is nonsense. Despite formal indications that it may be beneficial for Russia in modern realities, Russia has never practiced it. And Russia does not have such a global influence on these territories as the USSR had. Even without Russia there are a lot of interested parties in the next unleashing of this long-standing conflict.
The collective West has simply realized that it has suffered a complete fiasco against Russia in Ukraine, and wants to switch accents and do its favorite business, namely selling arms to the conflicting parties and profiting from it.
However, from my personal point of view (I may of course be wrong in my predictions), but unlike the situation in Ukraine, where the collective West had a full consensus against Russia, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict may not meet with such consensus in the West. Jewish lobbies are very strong in the U.S. and Arab lobbies in Europe. So Israel will be pressured too. If the European Union was more independent from the U.S., it could put pressure on Israel, at least to prevent serious military action on the part of Israel. But there are a lot of "BUTs." So we'll see what happens. Predicting anything is very difficult. I have known this conflict for a long time, I have studied it, I have been in the Middle East for different periods of time, there are a lot of intertwining and different interests and contradictions, absolutely different in their essence.

Bobby wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 27, 2023 8:38 pm

milster wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 27, 2023 8:11 pm

Frankly, I don't pick either side here. While I could say that both sides did some pretty vile things. I have no illusion that Hamas are some sort of freedom fighters, because they are not and they definitely do not hold average Palestinians in heart. I in fact believe that since Hamas is created in the West, that Israel may have their hand in it. Just think every time there was supposed to be some truce, Hamas blows up a building in Tel Aviv and the conflict continues. Unfortunately, the conflict lasts for very long and as long as there is no real desire for achieving peace (from both sides, mind you), then it'll continue as the decades of this shit are persevering to happen.
Also, one very interesting thing here. Since this conflict renewal weeks ago, almost no one mentions anymore Russo-Ukrainian conflict. It's not anymore the main topic.

Interesting point: The West is causing Putin problems regarding the Ukraine war and suddenly Israel is attacked and the West is seriously distracted. Maybe Putin wrote a big cheque to Hamas.........

He should be thankful to them, or Zelensky. Now no one can see how grifting his scheme became.

I think personnaly Benyamin Netanyahou should have first make free the Hamas prisonners and get back the ostages ...
Then he will have been able to do what ever he wants and send the terrest army against Hamas without be obliged bombing so many innocent people.
Now I feel this situation is going to take a lot of time and make the Gaza civilians suffering a lot while many of them are not responsible for the Hamas action.

All war are sad and I hate it !!!

Il n'y aurai jamais la pas en israel/palestine les deux camps sont trop remplis d'extremistes qui ne revent que de détruire l'autre, il n'y a qu'a voir netanyahu qui avait dit en 2015 qu'hitler ne voulait pas tuer les juifs et que c'etait les leaders palestiniens qui lui avaient insuflé cette idée, le type est tellement en haine des palestiniens qu'il en est pret a dédouaner hitler et les nazis pour charger ca sur les dos des palestieniens et attiser la haine contre eux.

C'est triste pour tous les innocents des deux bords qui payent le prix de des choix ceux qui sont au pouvoirs des deux cotés et qui se prennent toutes les bombes et les balles dans la gueule. Mais rien de nouveaux on savait deja que les leaders s'en carrent un peu du peuple.

TheAnt wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 27, 2024 4:41 pm

Il n'y aurai jamais la pas en israel/palestine les deux camps sont trop remplis d'extremistes qui ne revent que de détruire l'autre, il n'y a qu'a voir netanyahu qui avait dit en 2015 qu'hitler ne voulait pas tuer les juifs et que c'etait les leaders palestiniens qui lui avaient insuflé cette idée, le type est tellement en haine des palestiniens qu'il en est pret a dédouaner hitler et les nazis pour charger ca sur les dos des palestieniens et attiser la haine contre eux.

Israel is practically under the full patronage of the US. In turn, in the US, there are very strong Jewish political and financial lobbies. And they have two qualities in common that they have invented. And the second one, derives from the first one.
1). They think they are better than others. If Jews, consider themselves better than others, because, it comes from their ancient origin, and they have always considered themselves "God's chosen people", and other nations despised. It is for these qualities that they were disliked. And the USA has risen economically and politically very well, after two world wars, and its favorable geographical position, behind two oceans. They were not touched by the devastation after the wars, and they took great advantage of it. After the ideological confrontation with the USSR, when the Soviet Union self-dismissed, the U.S. fell into a state of euphoria, and thought of itself as an "exceptional nation", as repeatedly repeated like mantras by such lousy preachers as Obama and others.

2). The second quality, derives from the first. On the background of the described first quality, they believe that they can do whatever they want in their own interests, and others are not allowed. That is why they create various pretexts to do whatever they want in this world for their own selfish interests. And often they don't even bother to think up any pretexts. And they do not care about the interests of others, and in addition, they begin to contain any geopolitical or economic competitors, not hesitating to use any means, up to international terrorism and color revolutions.

Returning to Israel, in addition to my analysis, they think they are allowed everything. In response to all accusations against them, they remind us of the "Holocaust". Although they themselves have long neglected the memory of this tragedy, for example, by supporting the Nazi political regime in Ukraine, or what you are talking about. Then they take offense at Russia for not supporting them in the struggle against Palestine. Phenomenal simplicity and chutzpah in one package. Before the Hamas terrorist attack, they sent more than 300 thousand shells to Ukraine, and now they complain that they do not have enough ammunition and beg the US for it.

All countries unfortunately have emerged from conflict or war and the winner decided where is the line who limit is territory.
If Israel has respected the original agreement I think there will be for long time peace in middle orient but after the death of Kennedy and support of USA all has changed and the expansionist mind of Israel for his colons brought problems and the situation we all knows today ...


PW

PIERRE WOODMAN wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 27, 2024 7:38 pm

All countries unfortunately have emerged from conflict or war and the winner decided where is the line who limit is territory.
If Israel has respected the original agreement I think there will be for long time peace in middle orient but after the death of Kennedy and support of USA all has changed and the expansionist mind of Israel for his colons brought problems and the situation we all knows today ...


PW

we ( Indians ) are always support to Israel but when see GAZA and all its horrible situation Seeing young children suffer is very painful, especially when one realizes that the path they are on today and the future ahead will be filled with immense difficulties and horrors; there is no doubt that something dreadful is coming.

Elon Musk quickly plans to establish a colony on Mars, where half of the Earth's population will eventually reside.